Jasher and Saraijah in School Activity
Nothing but Trash: Part 1 (Neil Andi Anderson)
Its been quite some time doing this blog, and I decide to put something that I encountered on some social media. I was surprised by one of the INC members who's seriously harsh and rude in his way of conversation. I thought INC were taught to change their lives? but it seems it was just a gimmick. Their mind control beginsx after they're taught to hate and to talk trash to someone who believe they can't defend their right of religion. The Mocking or scorning and some fallacious words they love to throw that are even supported by their co-members. So here I introduce you to their trashfulness (I don't know if such word exist). Here's some of the examples that I collected and won't recommend to everyone who wants a healthy discussion it is part of their religious teachings or doctrine to hate everyone who gets on their way.
AD Hominem - most useful attack of INC fake accounts. It's their Natural Manner but they don't like to show it to everyone for the sake of INC Doctrine Number 17. That's why they use a fake account.
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| Neil Andi Anderson use the word "Kasing liit sa utak ng kuto. Nice Example |
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| Stupidity of lies between US? Just when did I lie to you Neil? It's your teachings and of course I opposed your man made doctrine. |
Nothing but Trash: Part 1 (Neil Andi Anderson)
Its been quite some time doing this blog, and I decide to put something that I encountered on some social media. I was surprised by one of the INC members who's seriously harsh and rude in his way of conversation. I thought INC were taught to change their lives? but it seems it was just a gimmick. Their mind control beginsx after they're taught to hate and to talk trash to someone who believe they can't defend their right of religion. The Mocking or scorning and some fallacious words they love to throw that are even supported by their co-members. So here I introduce you to their trashfulness (I don't know if such word exist). Here's some of the examples that I collected and won't recommend to everyone who wants a healthy discussion it is part of their religious teachings or doctrine to hate everyone who gets on their way.
AD Hominem - most useful attack of INC fake accounts. It's their Natural Manner but they don't like to show it to everyone for the sake of INC Doctrine Number 17. That's why they use a fake account.
 |
| Neil Andi Anderson use the word "Kasing liit sa utak ng kuto. Nice Example |
 |
| Stupidity of lies between US? Just when did I lie to you Neil? It's your teachings and of course I opposed your man made doctrine. |
Missionary Experience
Missionaries were walking and wanted to have a good investigator to teach. While in the small town they saw a nice house and plan to knock on doors so that they could teach people about the message.
Elder 1: Now this one is perfect. Let's go and knock on doors and see if we can teach to them the restoration.
While knocking, they notice that someone's running inside the house and hiding. Still, they keep on knocking for a few minutes. Then finally they decided to go to other houses because they think the house owner is not interested in their teachings.
Elder 2: Okay Elder, let's go and find a good one. But before that, we will leave a note to this house so that people will realize the messages we have are important for their salvation.
Elder 1: Okay, so what will be the scripture verse you'll quote in?
Elder 2: This one, "Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me. - Revelation 3:20"
Elder 1: So, do you think that scripture message will work and might be someday they understand it and be baptized?
Elder 2: Don't worry Elder, they will understand it.
Main while as they keep knocking on the doors of different houses, the missionary was so disappointed for most of them rejected the missionaries and their teachings. So the two decide to find a good spot in a different town perhaps they could get a good investigator. And while on their way back, they noticed the first house where they'd put a note in the gate. And to their surprise, their note was answered, so they passed by and read the message on the gate.
Elder 1: Hey Elder, look at that. They reply to our posted note. Now this one is perfect.
Elder 2: I see, now read what the note says.
Elder 1: It's a scriptural verse too. That says uh! "And he said, I heard thy voice in the garden, and I was afraid because I was naked, and I hid myself. - Genesis 3:10"
Elder 2: I'm sure they will be baptized.
Elder 1: That's great, now let's teach them.
Elder 1: Now this one is perfect. Let's go and knock on doors and see if we can teach to them the restoration.
While knocking, they notice that someone's running inside the house and hiding. Still, they keep on knocking for a few minutes. Then finally they decided to go to other houses because they think the house owner is not interested in their teachings.
Elder 2: Okay Elder, let's go and find a good one. But before that, we will leave a note to this house so that people will realize the messages we have are important for their salvation.
Elder 1: Okay, so what will be the scripture verse you'll quote in?
Elder 2: This one, "Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me. - Revelation 3:20"
Elder 1: So, do you think that scripture message will work and might be someday they understand it and be baptized?
Elder 2: Don't worry Elder, they will understand it.
Main while as they keep knocking on the doors of different houses, the missionary was so disappointed for most of them rejected the missionaries and their teachings. So the two decide to find a good spot in a different town perhaps they could get a good investigator. And while on their way back, they noticed the first house where they'd put a note in the gate. And to their surprise, their note was answered, so they passed by and read the message on the gate.
Elder 1: Hey Elder, look at that. They reply to our posted note. Now this one is perfect.
Elder 2: I see, now read what the note says.
Elder 1: It's a scriptural verse too. That says uh! "And he said, I heard thy voice in the garden, and I was afraid because I was naked, and I hid myself. - Genesis 3:10"
Elder 2: I'm sure they will be baptized.
Elder 1: That's great, now let's teach them.
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| To the Missionaries of Philippines Olongapo Mission |
Missionary Experience
Missionaries were walking and wanted to have a good investigator to teach. While in the small town they saw a nice house and plan to knock on doors so that they could teach people about the message.
Elder 1: Now this one is perfect. Let's go and knock on doors and see if we can teach to them the restoration.
While knocking, they notice that someone's running inside the house and hiding. Still, they keep on knocking for a few minutes. Then finally they decided to go to other houses because they think the house owner is not interested in their teachings.
Elder 2: Okay Elder, let's go and find a good one. But before that, we will leave a note to this house so that people will realize the messages we have are important for their salvation.
Elder 1: Okay, so what will be the scripture verse you'll quote in?
Elder 2: This one, "Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me. - Revelation 3:20"
Elder 1: So, do you think that scripture message will work and might be someday they understand it and be baptized?
Elder 2: Don't worry Elder, they will understand it.
Main while as they keep knocking on the doors of different houses, the missionary was so disappointed for most of them rejected the missionaries and their teachings. So the two decide to find a good spot in a different town perhaps they could get a good investigator. And while on their way back, they noticed the first house where they'd put a note in the gate. And to their surprise, their note was answered, so they passed by and read the message on the gate.
Elder 1: Hey Elder, look at that. They reply to our posted note. Now this one is perfect.
Elder 2: I see, now read what the note says.
Elder 1: It's a scriptural verse too. That says uh! "And he said, I heard thy voice in the garden, and I was afraid because I was naked, and I hid myself. - Genesis 3:10"
Elder 2: I'm sure they will be baptized.
Elder 1: That's great, now let's teach them.
Elder 1: Now this one is perfect. Let's go and knock on doors and see if we can teach to them the restoration.
While knocking, they notice that someone's running inside the house and hiding. Still, they keep on knocking for a few minutes. Then finally they decided to go to other houses because they think the house owner is not interested in their teachings.
Elder 2: Okay Elder, let's go and find a good one. But before that, we will leave a note to this house so that people will realize the messages we have are important for their salvation.
Elder 1: Okay, so what will be the scripture verse you'll quote in?
Elder 2: This one, "Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me. - Revelation 3:20"
Elder 1: So, do you think that scripture message will work and might be someday they understand it and be baptized?
Elder 2: Don't worry Elder, they will understand it.
Main while as they keep knocking on the doors of different houses, the missionary was so disappointed for most of them rejected the missionaries and their teachings. So the two decide to find a good spot in a different town perhaps they could get a good investigator. And while on their way back, they noticed the first house where they'd put a note in the gate. And to their surprise, their note was answered, so they passed by and read the message on the gate.
Elder 1: Hey Elder, look at that. They reply to our posted note. Now this one is perfect.
Elder 2: I see, now read what the note says.
Elder 1: It's a scriptural verse too. That says uh! "And he said, I heard thy voice in the garden, and I was afraid because I was naked, and I hid myself. - Genesis 3:10"
Elder 2: I'm sure they will be baptized.
Elder 1: That's great, now let's teach them.
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| To the Missionaries of Philippines Olongapo Mission |
Part 7 - Job Bautista's Study of John's Revelation: Not to Add or Diminish
Here's another outrageous post from our friendly INC neighborhood. He thinks he understood it right while the text shows different insights. Text in red is my response, some colored text from scriptures.
Pagbubunyag sa maling aral ng Lds cut church: as his intro goes. He tried to bring up something that has been debunked a couple of times in this blog. He always fails and missed some important things in his study.
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| John writes the Revelation. John of Patmos (also called John the Revelator, John the Divine, John the Theologian) is the name traditionally given to the author of the Book of Revelation. The text of Revelation states that John was on Patmos, a Greek island where, according to most biblical historians, he was exiled as a result of anti-Christian persecution under the Roman emperor. Wikipedia Read here for the Book of Revelation |
John wrote his revelation in Patmos Isle. The Revelation was not yet compiled in the Bible soon after he vanishes and the discovery of his writings in Patmos isle. Job Bautista adapted this from critics long been debunked, before he knew this issue. In other words, you are too late Job Bautista.
Malinaw ang sabi ni Apostol Juan na huwag bawasan ni Dagdagan ang nakasulat sa Banal na kasulatan. Rev. 22:18-19. The revelation of John Never did say something about the entire scripture but rather the Revelation he received. His writing was written before the compilation of the scriptures of the Bible, but most people like Job Bautista used it as the entire book of Scripture. John's proclamation was intended for his revelation as to never add or diminished what is revealed to him.
But what did John really mean when he says it? Was it the conclusion of the Canon or should we say he mean to close the entire Bible while it was not yet compiled as a volume? Or the revelations that he received while writing it? So, I'll be waiting for your response to this one Job Bautista.
Upang ipasok ang aral ng demonyo kanilang ipinasok ang aral ni Sator na ang sabi hangal daw na magkakaroon ng Biblia. And where does it says that? Where does it say that the book of Mormon will insert something in the scriptures? And when did it says that Someone is a fool because of the Bible? So here's his lying goes and let's prove that in the Scriptures he quoted below is the 2 Nephi 29:3-4, 6, 10 as his selected scripture verses.
3 And because my words shall hiss forth—many of the Gentiles shall say: A Bible! A Bible! We have got a Bible, and there cannot be any more Bible.4 But thus saith the Lord God: O fools, they shall have a Bible; and it shall proceed forth from the Jews, mine ancient covenant people. And what thank they the Jews for the Bible which they receive from them? Yea, what do the Gentiles mean? Do they remember the travails, and the labors, and the pains of the Jews, and their diligence unto me, in bringing forth salvation unto the Gentiles?
5 O ye Gentiles, have ye remembered the Jews, mine ancient covenant people? Nay; but ye have cursed them, and have hated them, and have not sought to recover them. But behold, I will return all these things upon your own heads; for I the Lord have not forgotten my people.
6 Thou fool, that shall say: A Bible, we have got a Bible, and we need no more Bible. Have ye obtained a Bible save it were by the Jews?
7 Know ye not that there are more nations than one? Know ye not that I, the Lord your God, have created all men, and that I remember those who are upon the isles of the sea; and that I rule in the heavens above and in the earth beneath; and I bring forth my word unto the children of men, yea, even upon all the nations of the earth?
8 Wherefore murmur ye, because that ye shall receive more of my word? Know ye not that the testimony of two nations is a witness unto you that I am God, that I remember one nation like unto another? Wherefore, I speak the same words unto one nation like unto another. And when the two nations shall run together the testimony of the two nations shall run together also.
9 And I do this that I may prove unto many that I am the same yesterday, today, and forever; and that I speak forth my words according to mine own pleasure. And because that I have spoken one word ye need not suppose that I cannot speak another; for my work is not yet finished; neither shall it be until the end of man, neither from that time henceforth and forever.
10 Wherefore, because that ye have a Bible ye need not suppose that it contains all my words; neither need ye suppose that I have not caused more to be written.
The funny part was, he's trying to say that those people who had a Bible are foolish because of those verses that prove it. Will first, it was addressed to the Gentile nation who never wrote the Bible Job Bautista. Come on! Take time in understanding it.
And second is, it was all about the other scripture (another Witness) aside from the Bible that was obtained by the Gentiles through the Jews.
4 Ngunit ganito ang wika ng Panginoong Diyos: O mga hangal, sila’y magkakaroon ng Biblia; at iyon ay manggagaling sa mga Judio, na aking mga sinaunang pinagtipanang tao. At ano ang pasasalamatan nila sa mga Judio sa Biblia na kanilang tinanggap mula sa kanila? Oo, ano ang ibig sabihin ng mga Gentil? Naaalaala ba nila ang mga paghihirap, at ang mga pagpapagal, at ang mga pasakit ng mga Judio, at ang kanilang pagsusumikap para sa akin, sa pagdadala ng kaligtasan sa mga Gentil?
5 O kayong mga Gentil, inyo bang naaalaala ang mga Judio, na aking mga sinaunang pinagtipanang tao? Hindi, kundi inyong isinumpa sila, at kinamuhian sila, at hindi naghangad na sila ay mabawi. Ngunit masdan, ibabalik ko sa inyong sariling mga ulo ang lahat ng bagay na ito; sapagkat ako, ang Panginoon ay hindi nakalilimot sa aking mga tao.
6 Ikaw na hangal, na magsasabi: Isang Biblia, mayroon na kaming Biblia, at hindi na namin kailangan pa ng karagdagang Biblia. Nagkaroon ba kayo ng Biblia maliban sa ito ay sa pamamagitan ng mga Judio?
7 Hindi ba ninyo alam na maraming bansa hindi lamang iisa? Hindi ba ninyo alam na ako, ang Panginoon ninyong Diyos, ang lumikha sa lahat ng tao, at naaalaala ko yaong mga nasa bpulo ng dagat; at na ako ang namamahala sa kalangitan sa itaas at sa lupa sa ibaba; at isinisiwalat ko ang aking salita sa mga anak ng tao, oo, maging sa lahat ng bansa sa mundo?
8 Dahil dito, bumulung-bulong kayo, dahil ba sa kayo ay tatanggap pa ng karagdagang salita ko? Hindi ba ninyo alam na ang patotoo ng dalawang bansa ay saksi sa inyo na ako nga ang Diyos, na naaalaala ko ang isang bansa gaya ng iba? Dahil dito, sinasabi ko ang mga gayon ding salita sa isang bansa gaya ng sa iba. At kapag ang dalawang bansa ay susulong na magkasabay, ang patotoo ng dalawang bansa ay susulong ding magkasabay.
9 At ito ay ginagawa ko upang mapatunayan ko sa marami na ako rin ang siyang kahapon, ngayon, at magpakailanman; at sinasabi ko ang aking mga salita alinsunod sa aking sariling kasiyahan. At sapagkat ako’y nakapagsabi na ng isang salita ay hindi ninyo dapat akalain na hindi na ako muling magsasalita; sapagkat ang aking gawain ay hindi pa natatapos; ni hindi pa hanggang sa katapusan ng tao, ni sa simula ng panahong iyon at magpakailanman.
10 Dahil dito, sapagkat mayroon kayong Biblia ay hindi ninyo dapat akalain na yaon ay naglalaman na ng lahat kong salita; ni hindi ninyo dapat akalain na ako ay hindi na magpapasulat pa ng karagdagan.
From Book of Mormon Central who made a short overview about 2 Nephi 29:8
Let's make it very simple Job Bautista for your understanding since you are too slow to comprehend the writings. Here I'll post a Tagalog version for you. So let try to see how you understand it in our very own language. Let's go -
3 At dahil ang aking mga salita ay titimo—Marami sa mga Gentil ang magsasabi: Isang Biblia! Isang Biblia! Mayroon na kaming Biblia, at hindi na magkakaroon pa ng karagdagang Biblia.4 Ngunit ganito ang wika ng Panginoong Diyos: O mga hangal, sila’y magkakaroon ng Biblia; at iyon ay manggagaling sa mga Judio, na aking mga sinaunang pinagtipanang tao. At ano ang pasasalamatan nila sa mga Judio sa Biblia na kanilang tinanggap mula sa kanila? Oo, ano ang ibig sabihin ng mga Gentil? Naaalaala ba nila ang mga paghihirap, at ang mga pagpapagal, at ang mga pasakit ng mga Judio, at ang kanilang pagsusumikap para sa akin, sa pagdadala ng kaligtasan sa mga Gentil?
5 O kayong mga Gentil, inyo bang naaalaala ang mga Judio, na aking mga sinaunang pinagtipanang tao? Hindi, kundi inyong isinumpa sila, at kinamuhian sila, at hindi naghangad na sila ay mabawi. Ngunit masdan, ibabalik ko sa inyong sariling mga ulo ang lahat ng bagay na ito; sapagkat ako, ang Panginoon ay hindi nakalilimot sa aking mga tao.
6 Ikaw na hangal, na magsasabi: Isang Biblia, mayroon na kaming Biblia, at hindi na namin kailangan pa ng karagdagang Biblia. Nagkaroon ba kayo ng Biblia maliban sa ito ay sa pamamagitan ng mga Judio?
7 Hindi ba ninyo alam na maraming bansa hindi lamang iisa? Hindi ba ninyo alam na ako, ang Panginoon ninyong Diyos, ang lumikha sa lahat ng tao, at naaalaala ko yaong mga nasa bpulo ng dagat; at na ako ang namamahala sa kalangitan sa itaas at sa lupa sa ibaba; at isinisiwalat ko ang aking salita sa mga anak ng tao, oo, maging sa lahat ng bansa sa mundo?
8 Dahil dito, bumulung-bulong kayo, dahil ba sa kayo ay tatanggap pa ng karagdagang salita ko? Hindi ba ninyo alam na ang patotoo ng dalawang bansa ay saksi sa inyo na ako nga ang Diyos, na naaalaala ko ang isang bansa gaya ng iba? Dahil dito, sinasabi ko ang mga gayon ding salita sa isang bansa gaya ng sa iba. At kapag ang dalawang bansa ay susulong na magkasabay, ang patotoo ng dalawang bansa ay susulong ding magkasabay.
9 At ito ay ginagawa ko upang mapatunayan ko sa marami na ako rin ang siyang kahapon, ngayon, at magpakailanman; at sinasabi ko ang aking mga salita alinsunod sa aking sariling kasiyahan. At sapagkat ako’y nakapagsabi na ng isang salita ay hindi ninyo dapat akalain na hindi na ako muling magsasalita; sapagkat ang aking gawain ay hindi pa natatapos; ni hindi pa hanggang sa katapusan ng tao, ni sa simula ng panahong iyon at magpakailanman.
10 Dahil dito, sapagkat mayroon kayong Biblia ay hindi ninyo dapat akalain na yaon ay naglalaman na ng lahat kong salita; ni hindi ninyo dapat akalain na ako ay hindi na magpapasulat pa ng karagdagan.
So there's the Tagalog version. Did you catch it? Or maybe no? Let me explain that in Tagalog Job Bautista -
Kapansinpasin Job Bautista na di mo naintindihan ang nakasulat. Pinatutuhan sa verse 3 na ang mga Gentile sa panahon natin ngayon ay magkakaroon ng Bibliya at dito sinasabi nila sa araw na iyun na "meron na kaming bibliya at hindi na magkaroon ng karagdagang bibliya" sa madaling Salita Job Bautista, hindi nila tatangapin ang Aklat ni Mormon, kagaya mo na kahit anong copy paste di mo parin naintindihan mga pinagkokopya mo. Ngunit pinaliwanag ni Nephi na isang hangal ang nagsasabi di na nila kailangan ng iba pang karagdagang kasulatan o bibliya dahil hindi natatapos ang gawain o Salita ng Dios. O Ano gets mo na? (Read the underlined words in the verses to understand it)
Therefore we ought to give the more earnest heed to the things which we have heard, lest at any time we should let them slip.
2 For if the word spoken by angels was steadfast, and every transgression and disobedience received a just recompence of reward;
8 ¶ For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD.
9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.
10 For as the rain cometh down, and the snow from heaven, and returneth not thither, but watereth the earth, and maketh it bring forth and bud, that it may give seed to the sower, and bread to the eater:
11 So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.
12 For ye shall go out with joy, and be led forth with peace: the mountains and the hills shall break forth before you into singing, and all the trees of the field shall clap their hands.
13 Instead of the thorn shall come up the fir tree, and instead of the brier shall come up the myrtle tree: and it shall be to the LORD for a name, for an everlasting sign that shall not be cut off.
Natitiyak natin na talagang ito ay gawa ng demonyo ayaw kasi ng demonyo na mabasa ang katotohanan na nakasulat sa Biblia. Juan 17:17 I pretty much agree, the very reason why you cherry-pick the most part is, that says only on your doctrine as INC and trash the others and proclaims it false Translation. I do agree that the demon holds the truth away from you through bigotry. (John 17:17 seems irrelevant to this topic. I don't know what you are up to, but maybe you're trying to say the word of God is true. No one object of that here. Maybe you misunderstood it as same as always) at ang Biblia ang siyang kinasihan ng Diyos na aklat ayon sa 2 Tim. 3:15-17, I have answered this already some time in our discussion and still, you don't want to accept it. If want to look at it some time you can check back and grab Some popcorn for some lectures to follow. https://truth-reflects.blogspot.com/2021/09/job-bautista-stupid-study-of-church.html?m=1. Anyway, so it was my address to you, that Timothy's understanding about the scriptures is limited to the old testament or Torah in his childhood days as Paul had said. The New Testament is not yet introduced to Timothy during Paul's declaration in his letter to him. This means it is not yet a full collection of the Bible. You have been crushed already on that article we'd had discussed. Huwag patigasin ang inyong puso panghawakan ang katotohanan. Can you do that Job Bautista? See how many words you'd ignored already because of your bigoted doctrine of INCult. Don't be a hypocrite, will you? Heb. 2:1-2. I don't know what are you up to in quoting these verses from Hebrews, but perhaps it helps you understand the truth rather keep sticking to the doctrine of you INC. So here's the text below to help you with it -
[Hebrews 2]Therefore we ought to give the more earnest heed to the things which we have heard, lest at any time we should let them slip.
2 For if the word spoken by angels was steadfast, and every transgression and disobedience received a just recompence of reward;
Tuparin ang salita ng Diyos. Yes, of course. So it's your assignment to find out the word of God write in the scriptures, not in a selected version and cherry-picks. You just keep fooling yourself in your understanding. Don't be too hard to the truth.
[Isaiah 55]8 ¶ For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD.
9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.
10 For as the rain cometh down, and the snow from heaven, and returneth not thither, but watereth the earth, and maketh it bring forth and bud, that it may give seed to the sower, and bread to the eater:
11 So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.
12 For ye shall go out with joy, and be led forth with peace: the mountains and the hills shall break forth before you into singing, and all the trees of the field shall clap their hands.
13 Instead of the thorn shall come up the fir tree, and instead of the brier shall come up the myrtle tree: and it shall be to the LORD for a name, for an everlasting sign that shall not be cut off.
I use your scripture to help you understand God's way. My point here is simple. God can do all things whatever he wants and he loves his children. We must understand his words that is why he provided some means to clarify and to witness his Love for us. The Bible talks about Him and the Book of Mormon testify about the Bible. And thus the scripture says in 2 Corinthians 13
This is the third time I am coming to you. In the mouth of two or three witnesses shall every word be established.
And God's word is now established to understand the plan of salvation and redemption, and for us to avoid confusion.
1 Peter 1:25But the word of the Lord endureth forever. And this is the word which by the gospel is preached unto you.
This proves to us that God provided a plan to help us understand the truth. The Two scriptures work hand in hand and testify to each other in understanding the Gospel plan and thus it endures forever.
So here we can conclude that this INC member is not will oriented to scriptures and could never comprehend what was written. Thank you for proving it.
Part 7 - Job Bautista's Study of John's Revelation: Not to Add or Diminish
Here's another outrageous post from our friendly INC neighborhood. He thinks he understood it right while the text shows different insights. Text in red is my response, some colored text from scriptures.
Pagbubunyag sa maling aral ng Lds cut church: as his intro goes. He tried to bring up something that has been debunked a couple of times in this blog. He always fails and missed some important things in his study.
 |
| John writes the Revelation. John of Patmos (also called John the Revelator, John the Divine, John the Theologian) is the name traditionally given to the author of the Book of Revelation. The text of Revelation states that John was on Patmos, a Greek island where, according to most biblical historians, he was exiled as a result of anti-Christian persecution under the Roman emperor. Wikipedia Read here for the Book of Revelation |
John wrote his revelation in Patmos Isle. The Revelation was not yet compiled in the Bible soon after he vanishes and the discovery of his writings in Patmos isle. Job Bautista adapted this from critics long been debunked, before he knew this issue. In other words, you are too late Job Bautista.
Malinaw ang sabi ni Apostol Juan na huwag bawasan ni Dagdagan ang nakasulat sa Banal na kasulatan. Rev. 22:18-19. The revelation of John Never did say something about the entire scripture but rather the Revelation he received. His writing was written before the compilation of the scriptures of the Bible, but most people like Job Bautista used it as the entire book of Scripture. John's proclamation was intended for his revelation as to never add or diminished what is revealed to him.
But what did John really mean when he says it? Was it the conclusion of the Canon or should we say he mean to close the entire Bible while it was not yet compiled as a volume? Or the revelations that he received while writing it? So, I'll be waiting for your response to this one Job Bautista.
Upang ipasok ang aral ng demonyo kanilang ipinasok ang aral ni Sator na ang sabi hangal daw na magkakaroon ng Biblia. And where does it says that? Where does it say that the book of Mormon will insert something in the scriptures? And when did it says that Someone is a fool because of the Bible? So here's his lying goes and let's prove that in the Scriptures he quoted below is the 2 Nephi 29:3-4, 6, 10 as his selected scripture verses.
3 And because my words shall hiss forth—many of the Gentiles shall say: A Bible! A Bible! We have got a Bible, and there cannot be any more Bible.4 But thus saith the Lord God: O fools, they shall have a Bible; and it shall proceed forth from the Jews, mine ancient covenant people. And what thank they the Jews for the Bible which they receive from them? Yea, what do the Gentiles mean? Do they remember the travails, and the labors, and the pains of the Jews, and their diligence unto me, in bringing forth salvation unto the Gentiles?
5 O ye Gentiles, have ye remembered the Jews, mine ancient covenant people? Nay; but ye have cursed them, and have hated them, and have not sought to recover them. But behold, I will return all these things upon your own heads; for I the Lord have not forgotten my people.
6 Thou fool, that shall say: A Bible, we have got a Bible, and we need no more Bible. Have ye obtained a Bible save it were by the Jews?
7 Know ye not that there are more nations than one? Know ye not that I, the Lord your God, have created all men, and that I remember those who are upon the isles of the sea; and that I rule in the heavens above and in the earth beneath; and I bring forth my word unto the children of men, yea, even upon all the nations of the earth?
8 Wherefore murmur ye, because that ye shall receive more of my word? Know ye not that the testimony of two nations is a witness unto you that I am God, that I remember one nation like unto another? Wherefore, I speak the same words unto one nation like unto another. And when the two nations shall run together the testimony of the two nations shall run together also.
9 And I do this that I may prove unto many that I am the same yesterday, today, and forever; and that I speak forth my words according to mine own pleasure. And because that I have spoken one word ye need not suppose that I cannot speak another; for my work is not yet finished; neither shall it be until the end of man, neither from that time henceforth and forever.
10 Wherefore, because that ye have a Bible ye need not suppose that it contains all my words; neither need ye suppose that I have not caused more to be written.
The funny part was, he's trying to say that those people who had a Bible are foolish because of those verses that prove it. Will first, it was addressed to the Gentile nation who never wrote the Bible Job Bautista. Come on! Take time in understanding it.
And second is, it was all about the other scripture (another Witness) aside from the Bible that was obtained by the Gentiles through the Jews.
4 Ngunit ganito ang wika ng Panginoong Diyos: O mga hangal, sila’y magkakaroon ng Biblia; at iyon ay manggagaling sa mga Judio, na aking mga sinaunang pinagtipanang tao. At ano ang pasasalamatan nila sa mga Judio sa Biblia na kanilang tinanggap mula sa kanila? Oo, ano ang ibig sabihin ng mga Gentil? Naaalaala ba nila ang mga paghihirap, at ang mga pagpapagal, at ang mga pasakit ng mga Judio, at ang kanilang pagsusumikap para sa akin, sa pagdadala ng kaligtasan sa mga Gentil?
5 O kayong mga Gentil, inyo bang naaalaala ang mga Judio, na aking mga sinaunang pinagtipanang tao? Hindi, kundi inyong isinumpa sila, at kinamuhian sila, at hindi naghangad na sila ay mabawi. Ngunit masdan, ibabalik ko sa inyong sariling mga ulo ang lahat ng bagay na ito; sapagkat ako, ang Panginoon ay hindi nakalilimot sa aking mga tao.
6 Ikaw na hangal, na magsasabi: Isang Biblia, mayroon na kaming Biblia, at hindi na namin kailangan pa ng karagdagang Biblia. Nagkaroon ba kayo ng Biblia maliban sa ito ay sa pamamagitan ng mga Judio?
7 Hindi ba ninyo alam na maraming bansa hindi lamang iisa? Hindi ba ninyo alam na ako, ang Panginoon ninyong Diyos, ang lumikha sa lahat ng tao, at naaalaala ko yaong mga nasa bpulo ng dagat; at na ako ang namamahala sa kalangitan sa itaas at sa lupa sa ibaba; at isinisiwalat ko ang aking salita sa mga anak ng tao, oo, maging sa lahat ng bansa sa mundo?
8 Dahil dito, bumulung-bulong kayo, dahil ba sa kayo ay tatanggap pa ng karagdagang salita ko? Hindi ba ninyo alam na ang patotoo ng dalawang bansa ay saksi sa inyo na ako nga ang Diyos, na naaalaala ko ang isang bansa gaya ng iba? Dahil dito, sinasabi ko ang mga gayon ding salita sa isang bansa gaya ng sa iba. At kapag ang dalawang bansa ay susulong na magkasabay, ang patotoo ng dalawang bansa ay susulong ding magkasabay.
9 At ito ay ginagawa ko upang mapatunayan ko sa marami na ako rin ang siyang kahapon, ngayon, at magpakailanman; at sinasabi ko ang aking mga salita alinsunod sa aking sariling kasiyahan. At sapagkat ako’y nakapagsabi na ng isang salita ay hindi ninyo dapat akalain na hindi na ako muling magsasalita; sapagkat ang aking gawain ay hindi pa natatapos; ni hindi pa hanggang sa katapusan ng tao, ni sa simula ng panahong iyon at magpakailanman.
10 Dahil dito, sapagkat mayroon kayong Biblia ay hindi ninyo dapat akalain na yaon ay naglalaman na ng lahat kong salita; ni hindi ninyo dapat akalain na ako ay hindi na magpapasulat pa ng karagdagan.
From Book of Mormon Central who made a short overview about 2 Nephi 29:8
Let's make it very simple Job Bautista for your understanding since you are too slow to comprehend the writings. Here I'll post a Tagalog version for you. So let try to see how you understand it in our very own language. Let's go -
3 At dahil ang aking mga salita ay titimo—Marami sa mga Gentil ang magsasabi: Isang Biblia! Isang Biblia! Mayroon na kaming Biblia, at hindi na magkakaroon pa ng karagdagang Biblia.4 Ngunit ganito ang wika ng Panginoong Diyos: O mga hangal, sila’y magkakaroon ng Biblia; at iyon ay manggagaling sa mga Judio, na aking mga sinaunang pinagtipanang tao. At ano ang pasasalamatan nila sa mga Judio sa Biblia na kanilang tinanggap mula sa kanila? Oo, ano ang ibig sabihin ng mga Gentil? Naaalaala ba nila ang mga paghihirap, at ang mga pagpapagal, at ang mga pasakit ng mga Judio, at ang kanilang pagsusumikap para sa akin, sa pagdadala ng kaligtasan sa mga Gentil?
5 O kayong mga Gentil, inyo bang naaalaala ang mga Judio, na aking mga sinaunang pinagtipanang tao? Hindi, kundi inyong isinumpa sila, at kinamuhian sila, at hindi naghangad na sila ay mabawi. Ngunit masdan, ibabalik ko sa inyong sariling mga ulo ang lahat ng bagay na ito; sapagkat ako, ang Panginoon ay hindi nakalilimot sa aking mga tao.
6 Ikaw na hangal, na magsasabi: Isang Biblia, mayroon na kaming Biblia, at hindi na namin kailangan pa ng karagdagang Biblia. Nagkaroon ba kayo ng Biblia maliban sa ito ay sa pamamagitan ng mga Judio?
7 Hindi ba ninyo alam na maraming bansa hindi lamang iisa? Hindi ba ninyo alam na ako, ang Panginoon ninyong Diyos, ang lumikha sa lahat ng tao, at naaalaala ko yaong mga nasa bpulo ng dagat; at na ako ang namamahala sa kalangitan sa itaas at sa lupa sa ibaba; at isinisiwalat ko ang aking salita sa mga anak ng tao, oo, maging sa lahat ng bansa sa mundo?
8 Dahil dito, bumulung-bulong kayo, dahil ba sa kayo ay tatanggap pa ng karagdagang salita ko? Hindi ba ninyo alam na ang patotoo ng dalawang bansa ay saksi sa inyo na ako nga ang Diyos, na naaalaala ko ang isang bansa gaya ng iba? Dahil dito, sinasabi ko ang mga gayon ding salita sa isang bansa gaya ng sa iba. At kapag ang dalawang bansa ay susulong na magkasabay, ang patotoo ng dalawang bansa ay susulong ding magkasabay.
9 At ito ay ginagawa ko upang mapatunayan ko sa marami na ako rin ang siyang kahapon, ngayon, at magpakailanman; at sinasabi ko ang aking mga salita alinsunod sa aking sariling kasiyahan. At sapagkat ako’y nakapagsabi na ng isang salita ay hindi ninyo dapat akalain na hindi na ako muling magsasalita; sapagkat ang aking gawain ay hindi pa natatapos; ni hindi pa hanggang sa katapusan ng tao, ni sa simula ng panahong iyon at magpakailanman.
10 Dahil dito, sapagkat mayroon kayong Biblia ay hindi ninyo dapat akalain na yaon ay naglalaman na ng lahat kong salita; ni hindi ninyo dapat akalain na ako ay hindi na magpapasulat pa ng karagdagan.
So there's the Tagalog version. Did you catch it? Or maybe no? Let me explain that in Tagalog Job Bautista -
Kapansinpasin Job Bautista na di mo naintindihan ang nakasulat. Pinatutuhan sa verse 3 na ang mga Gentile sa panahon natin ngayon ay magkakaroon ng Bibliya at dito sinasabi nila sa araw na iyun na "meron na kaming bibliya at hindi na magkaroon ng karagdagang bibliya" sa madaling Salita Job Bautista, hindi nila tatangapin ang Aklat ni Mormon, kagaya mo na kahit anong copy paste di mo parin naintindihan mga pinagkokopya mo. Ngunit pinaliwanag ni Nephi na isang hangal ang nagsasabi di na nila kailangan ng iba pang karagdagang kasulatan o bibliya dahil hindi natatapos ang gawain o Salita ng Dios. O Ano gets mo na? (Read the underlined words in the verses to understand it)
Therefore we ought to give the more earnest heed to the things which we have heard, lest at any time we should let them slip.
2 For if the word spoken by angels was steadfast, and every transgression and disobedience received a just recompence of reward;
8 ¶ For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD.
9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.
10 For as the rain cometh down, and the snow from heaven, and returneth not thither, but watereth the earth, and maketh it bring forth and bud, that it may give seed to the sower, and bread to the eater:
11 So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.
12 For ye shall go out with joy, and be led forth with peace: the mountains and the hills shall break forth before you into singing, and all the trees of the field shall clap their hands.
13 Instead of the thorn shall come up the fir tree, and instead of the brier shall come up the myrtle tree: and it shall be to the LORD for a name, for an everlasting sign that shall not be cut off.
Natitiyak natin na talagang ito ay gawa ng demonyo ayaw kasi ng demonyo na mabasa ang katotohanan na nakasulat sa Biblia. Juan 17:17 I pretty much agree, the very reason why you cherry-pick the most part is, that says only on your doctrine as INC and trash the others and proclaims it false Translation. I do agree that the demon holds the truth away from you through bigotry. (John 17:17 seems irrelevant to this topic. I don't know what you are up to, but maybe you're trying to say the word of God is true. No one object of that here. Maybe you misunderstood it as same as always) at ang Biblia ang siyang kinasihan ng Diyos na aklat ayon sa 2 Tim. 3:15-17, I have answered this already some time in our discussion and still, you don't want to accept it. If want to look at it some time you can check back and grab Some popcorn for some lectures to follow. https://truth-reflects.blogspot.com/2021/09/job-bautista-stupid-study-of-church.html?m=1. Anyway, so it was my address to you, that Timothy's understanding about the scriptures is limited to the old testament or Torah in his childhood days as Paul had said. The New Testament is not yet introduced to Timothy during Paul's declaration in his letter to him. This means it is not yet a full collection of the Bible. You have been crushed already on that article we'd had discussed. Huwag patigasin ang inyong puso panghawakan ang katotohanan. Can you do that Job Bautista? See how many words you'd ignored already because of your bigoted doctrine of INCult. Don't be a hypocrite, will you? Heb. 2:1-2. I don't know what are you up to in quoting these verses from Hebrews, but perhaps it helps you understand the truth rather keep sticking to the doctrine of you INC. So here's the text below to help you with it -
[Hebrews 2]Therefore we ought to give the more earnest heed to the things which we have heard, lest at any time we should let them slip.
2 For if the word spoken by angels was steadfast, and every transgression and disobedience received a just recompence of reward;
Tuparin ang salita ng Diyos. Yes, of course. So it's your assignment to find out the word of God write in the scriptures, not in a selected version and cherry-picks. You just keep fooling yourself in your understanding. Don't be too hard to the truth.
[Isaiah 55]8 ¶ For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD.
9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.
10 For as the rain cometh down, and the snow from heaven, and returneth not thither, but watereth the earth, and maketh it bring forth and bud, that it may give seed to the sower, and bread to the eater:
11 So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.
12 For ye shall go out with joy, and be led forth with peace: the mountains and the hills shall break forth before you into singing, and all the trees of the field shall clap their hands.
13 Instead of the thorn shall come up the fir tree, and instead of the brier shall come up the myrtle tree: and it shall be to the LORD for a name, for an everlasting sign that shall not be cut off.
I use your scripture to help you understand God's way. My point here is simple. God can do all things whatever he wants and he loves his children. We must understand his words that is why he provided some means to clarify and to witness his Love for us. The Bible talks about Him and the Book of Mormon testify about the Bible. And thus the scripture says in 2 Corinthians 13
This is the third time I am coming to you. In the mouth of two or three witnesses shall every word be established.
And God's word is now established to understand the plan of salvation and redemption, and for us to avoid confusion.
1 Peter 1:25But the word of the Lord endureth forever. And this is the word which by the gospel is preached unto you.
This proves to us that God provided a plan to help us understand the truth. The Two scriptures work hand in hand and testify to each other in understanding the Gospel plan and thus it endures forever.
So here we can conclude that this INC member is not will oriented to scriptures and could never comprehend what was written. Thank you for proving it.
Part 4 - Neil Andi Anderson: Bigot Ministry Failure
This arrogant INC member thinks his wise enough to know the truth not knowing how he was brainwashed by their ministers. He think he can manipulate me with his doctrine. These are some of our selected conversations and I'll post it with response with his arrogant comment.
Jerry Nuñez Bustillo Ang pag-uugali mo Jerry boy ay puro lamang kamangmangan na nagmamarunong na nagaakala na matalino, you must have a balance of thinking bago mo tanggapin ang karunongan sa isang bible scholars kung may pagtatama ang kanyang pagkakaintindi. So, here goes the another arrogant comments from our friend Neil Andi Anderson, he said something about my commentary regarsing their ministey or doctrine. Look at how absurd? He ask me to have a balance thinking. really? so what do you think I did Neil? Do you find something like LDS doctrine in my post? It's on different source and different views, so how come you think it that way. I'm not quoting something from the LDS doctrine so that it would be fair to discuss just the Bible with you. But I think what you're saying is, to read also your ministry and doctrine. Basahin mo itong talata kung ano ang gagawin ng Diyos sa mga mangmang na tao na nagmamarunong na parang matalino. Basa moron! And look at that ad hominim of a immatured INC Member. ................................................................................................................................................................Sisirain ko ang karunungan ng marurunong at pawawalang kabuluhan ang talino ng matatalino. Actually, this has nothing to do with our topic the last time, but you keep posting irrelevant things and its ok for an immatured guy like you who knows just but a few doctine of your INC.
I'm assuming you quote 1 Corinthians 1:20-23 and I will highlight the text you give and will see how this make sense. Okay, so here we go -
20 Nasaan ang marunong? Nasaan ang guro ng kautusan? Nasaan ang nakikipagtalo ng kapanahunang ito? Hindi ba ang karunungan ng sanlibutang ito ay ginawa ng Diyos na kamangmangan? 21 Ito ay sapagkat sa karunungan ng Diyos, ang sanlibutan ay hindi nakakilala sa Diyos sa pamamagitan ng kanilang karunungan. Dahil dito ikinalugod ng Diyos na iligtas sila na sumasampalataya sa pamamagitan ng kamangmangan ng pangangaral. 22 Ang mga Judio ay humihingi ng tanda at ang mga Griyego ay naghahanap ng karunungan. 23 Ang aming ipinangangaral ay si Cristo na ipinako sa krus. Sa mga Judio siya Sisirain ko ang karunungan ng marurunong at pawawalang kabuluhan ang talino ng matatalino.
I don't know what are you up to and you posted this verses twice adding some part that I don't even think has the same meaning. See below -
20 Nasaan ang marunong? Nasaan ang guro ng kautusan? Nasaan ang nakikipagtalo ng kapanahunang ito? Hindi ba ang karunungan ng sanlibutang ito ay ginawa ng Diyos na kamangmangan? 21 Ito ay sapagkat sa karunungan ng Diyos, ang sanlibutan ay hindi nakakilala sa Diyos sa pamamagitan ng kanilang karunungan. Dahil dito ikinalugod ng Diyos na iligtas sila na sumasampalataya sa pamamagitan ng kamangmangan ng pangangaral. 22 Ang mga Judio ay humihingi ng tanda at ang mga Griyego ay naghahanap ng karunungan. 23 Ang aming ipinangangaral ay si Cristo na ipinako sa krus. Sa mga Judio siya ay katitisuran, sa mga Griyego siya ay kamangmangan. 24 Sa mga tinawag, Judio at Griyego, siya ay Cristo na siyang kapangyarihan ng Diyos at karunungan ng Diyos. 25 Ito ay sapagkat ang kamangmangan ng Diyos ay higit sa karunungan ng tao at ang kahinaan ng Diyos ay higit sa kalakasan ng tao. 26 Sapagkat nakita ninyo ang inyong pagkatawag, mga kapatid. Iilan lang ang matatalino ayon sa laman, iilan lang ang makapangyarihan, iilan lang ang maharlika na tinawag.
Napakalinaw sa mga talata na di po tayo dapat mananalig sa kanilang karunongan. You're quoting it not knowing how you became a victim of your own minister who brainwashed you what to say, what to read or study, and what to do. Ikaw na moron ka palagi kang nagmamatalino pero isa kang totoong mangmang. And look who's talking, calling someone a moron that make you a circus clown that don't even know what to do. His ad Hominem strikes makes him think he is wise, but it does makes him a fool. The scripture is even address for him and his arrogance.
[1 Corinthians 1]20 Where is the wise? where is the scribe? where is the disputer of this world? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world?
21 For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.
22 For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom:
23 But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness;
24 But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.
25 Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men.
26 For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called:
Part 4 - Neil Andi Anderson: Bigot Ministry Failure
This arrogant INC member thinks his wise enough to know the truth not knowing how he was brainwashed by their ministers. He think he can manipulate me with his doctrine. These are some of our selected conversations and I'll post it with response with his arrogant comment.
Jerry Nuñez Bustillo Ang pag-uugali mo Jerry boy ay puro lamang kamangmangan na nagmamarunong na nagaakala na matalino, you must have a balance of thinking bago mo tanggapin ang karunongan sa isang bible scholars kung may pagtatama ang kanyang pagkakaintindi. So, here goes the another arrogant comments from our friend Neil Andi Anderson, he said something about my commentary regarsing their ministey or doctrine. Look at how absurd? He ask me to have a balance thinking. really? so what do you think I did Neil? Do you find something like LDS doctrine in my post? It's on different source and different views, so how come you think it that way. I'm not quoting something from the LDS doctrine so that it would be fair to discuss just the Bible with you. But I think what you're saying is, to read also your ministry and doctrine. Basahin mo itong talata kung ano ang gagawin ng Diyos sa mga mangmang na tao na nagmamarunong na parang matalino. Basa moron! And look at that ad hominim of a immatured INC Member. ................................................................................................................................................................Sisirain ko ang karunungan ng marurunong at pawawalang kabuluhan ang talino ng matatalino. Actually, this has nothing to do with our topic the last time, but you keep posting irrelevant things and its ok for an immatured guy like you who knows just but a few doctine of your INC.
I'm assuming you quote 1 Corinthians 1:20-23 and I will highlight the text you give and will see how this make sense. Okay, so here we go -
20 Nasaan ang marunong? Nasaan ang guro ng kautusan? Nasaan ang nakikipagtalo ng kapanahunang ito? Hindi ba ang karunungan ng sanlibutang ito ay ginawa ng Diyos na kamangmangan? 21 Ito ay sapagkat sa karunungan ng Diyos, ang sanlibutan ay hindi nakakilala sa Diyos sa pamamagitan ng kanilang karunungan. Dahil dito ikinalugod ng Diyos na iligtas sila na sumasampalataya sa pamamagitan ng kamangmangan ng pangangaral. 22 Ang mga Judio ay humihingi ng tanda at ang mga Griyego ay naghahanap ng karunungan. 23 Ang aming ipinangangaral ay si Cristo na ipinako sa krus. Sa mga Judio siya Sisirain ko ang karunungan ng marurunong at pawawalang kabuluhan ang talino ng matatalino.
I don't know what are you up to and you posted this verses twice adding some part that I don't even think has the same meaning. See below -
20 Nasaan ang marunong? Nasaan ang guro ng kautusan? Nasaan ang nakikipagtalo ng kapanahunang ito? Hindi ba ang karunungan ng sanlibutang ito ay ginawa ng Diyos na kamangmangan? 21 Ito ay sapagkat sa karunungan ng Diyos, ang sanlibutan ay hindi nakakilala sa Diyos sa pamamagitan ng kanilang karunungan. Dahil dito ikinalugod ng Diyos na iligtas sila na sumasampalataya sa pamamagitan ng kamangmangan ng pangangaral. 22 Ang mga Judio ay humihingi ng tanda at ang mga Griyego ay naghahanap ng karunungan. 23 Ang aming ipinangangaral ay si Cristo na ipinako sa krus. Sa mga Judio siya ay katitisuran, sa mga Griyego siya ay kamangmangan. 24 Sa mga tinawag, Judio at Griyego, siya ay Cristo na siyang kapangyarihan ng Diyos at karunungan ng Diyos. 25 Ito ay sapagkat ang kamangmangan ng Diyos ay higit sa karunungan ng tao at ang kahinaan ng Diyos ay higit sa kalakasan ng tao. 26 Sapagkat nakita ninyo ang inyong pagkatawag, mga kapatid. Iilan lang ang matatalino ayon sa laman, iilan lang ang makapangyarihan, iilan lang ang maharlika na tinawag.
Napakalinaw sa mga talata na di po tayo dapat mananalig sa kanilang karunongan. You're quoting it not knowing how you became a victim of your own minister who brainwashed you what to say, what to read or study, and what to do. Ikaw na moron ka palagi kang nagmamatalino pero isa kang totoong mangmang. And look who's talking, calling someone a moron that make you a circus clown that don't even know what to do. His ad Hominem strikes makes him think he is wise, but it does makes him a fool. The scripture is even address for him and his arrogance.
[1 Corinthians 1]20 Where is the wise? where is the scribe? where is the disputer of this world? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world?
21 For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.
22 For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom:
23 But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness;
24 But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.
25 Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men.
26 For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called:
Part 6 - Job Bautista: Far East Study
Here's another Job Bautista fail Study. It's kinda funny though and how he made some assumptions about the propagation of The LDS in Book of Mormon times. Without further ado let's dive in - see text in red for my comments.
His introduction -
[Job Bautista]
Jerry Nuñez Bustillo
Lds cult church propagation start from the Southwart to Northward ; read -
And he thinks it is the start of LDS church using the Book of Mormon as evidence of some puzzles that he can't solve.
[Job Bautista]Helaman 3: 8 And it came to pass that they did multiply and spread, and did go forth from the land southward to the land northward, and did spread insomuch that they began to cover the face of the whole earth, from the sea south to the sea north, from the sea west to the sea east.
This story is not even related to any ministry or proselyting or whatever missionary related. This was all about the spread of their community southward of the land and they start their living. To understand the Context Job Bautista since you are always out of context and does not even care what you quoted, here's the part of it to see that it was not about sending missionary abroad, but rather their travel to the entire land to build their houses and whatsoever they can live.
[Helaman 3]
4 And they did travel to an exceedingly great distance, insomuch that they came to large bodies of water and many rivers.
5 Yea, and even they did spread forth into all parts of the land, into whatever parts it had not been rendered desolate and without timber, because of the many inhabitants who had before inherited the land.
6 And now no part of the land was desolate, save it were for timber; but because of the greatness of the destruction of the people who had before inhabited the land it was called desolate.
7 And there being but little timber upon the face of the land, nevertheless the people who went forth became exceedingly expert in the working of cement; therefore they did build houses of cement, in the which they did dwell.
8 And it came to pass that they did multiply and spread, and did go forth from the land southward to the land northward, and did spread insomuch that they began to cover the face of the whole earth, from the sea south to the sea north, from the sea west to the sea east.
9 And the people who were in the land northward did dwell in tents, and in houses of cement, and they did suffer whatsoever tree should spring up upon the face of the land that it should grow up, that in time they might have timber to build their houses, yea, their cities, and their temples, and their synagogues, and their sanctuaries, and all manner of their buildings.
So, what was it all about Job Bautista? Will I guest the Book of Mormon already explain that to you? Do you understand what you are point out or the doctrine of Manalo? I guess you need some Reading Comprehension. It's a Problems, you know.
[Job Bautista]
If you can see the propagation of the Lds church start from southward to Northward and they cover the face of the whole Earth ? And from the sea North , from the sea west to the East according to the BOM.
As I have said, it was not about the propagation or spreading of the Gospel. You just need some work out of your brain cells. Read the context and find something about sending missionaries or preaching the Gospel. You can't find it there because it wasn't all about it.
[Job Bautista]
We are sure that the the Lds church is not the true Church , because the direction of their propagation and place is different from direction of the prophecy of God written in the Bible . They are not the chosen people of God , they are the goats at the left hand of Jesus as describe.
And I'm pretty sure you are even worse than goats. And it was not yet spread during the time of Isaiah. Christ even proclaimed to avoid the way of the Gentile. You are just too slow to understand the scripture because of the bigoted teaching that you always insisted on.
Matthew 10:5 These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not:
Did Christ say something about preaching to the Gentiles? He clearly explains to avoid Gentiles' way for the gospel is not yet prepared for them. The propagation of the Gospel during Christ's time was yet limited to the Tribe of Israel. So how come the Philippines was the other sheep and how did they fulfill the prophecy while the gospel wasn't yet preached to them?
[Job Bautista]
You're brainwashed by your Paid Ministers. There is no prophesy that the gospel will start in the far east or from the west and wherever rather it will spread everywhere from the Jews first then to the Gentiles. And how would you define Christ said that it wasn't yet spread to the Gentile nation not until his ascension and there you are claiming it already in the Philippines. If you could trace the Line of Authority of Felix Manalo then we can simply start there rather than making a claim of some geographical pieces of evidence that has nothing to do with the Restoration of the Gospel.
[Job Bautista]
אַל־ (’al-)
Adverb
Strong's 408: Not
be afraid,
תִּירָ֖א (tî·rā)
Verb - Qal - Imperfect - second person masculine singular
Strong's 3372: To fear, to revere, caus, to frighten
for
כִּ֣י (kî)
Conjunction
Strong's 3588: A relative conjunction
I
אָ֑נִי (’ā·nî)
Pronoun - first person common singular
Strong's 589: I
am with you;
אִתְּךָ־ (’it·tə·ḵā-)
Preposition | second person masculine singular
Strong's 854: Nearness, near, with, by, at, among
I will bring
אָבִ֣יא (’ā·ḇî)
Verb - Hifil - Imperfect - first person common singular
Strong's 935: To come in, come, go in, go
your offspring
זַרְעֶ֔ךָ (zar·‘e·ḵā)
Noun - masculine singular construct | second person masculine singular
Strong's 2233: Seed, fruit, plant, sowing-time, posterity
from the east,
מִמִּזְרָח֙ (mim·miz·rāḥ)
Preposition-m | Noun - masculine singular
Strong's 4217: Place of sunrise, the east
and gather you
אֲקַבְּצֶֽךָּ׃ (’ă·qab·bə·ṣe·kā)
Verb - Piel - Imperfect - first person common singular | second person masculine singular
Strong's 6908: To gather, collect
from the west.
וּמִֽמַּעֲרָ֖ב (ū·mim·ma·‘ă·rāḇ)
Conjunctive waw, Preposition-m | Noun - masculine singular
Strong's 4628: The west
2 “When you pass through the waters, I will be with you; And through the rivers, they will not overflow you. When you walk through the fire, you will not be scorched, Nor will the flame burn you.
3 “For I am the LORD your God, The Holy One of Israel, your Savior; I have given Egypt as your ransom, [a]Cush and Seba in exchange for you.
4 “Since you are precious in My sight, Since you are honored and I love you, I will give other people in your place and other nations in exchange for your life.
5 “Do not fear, for I am with you; I will bring your offspring from the east, And gather you from the west.
This was all about the Promises of God to his Chosen people Israel and how they will be gathered even from a far country. It was never about the propagation or the missionary work but rather a physical gathering of the lost people or tribe of Israel.
OK so, I made so much explanation and it seems like it's your homework that I work out. You should know that Job Bautista, you're already matured enough to see how these things are irrelevant to your doctrine. This doesn't prove anything about the Philippines.
Let's try to look at some of the translations to confirm this scripture and that Job Bautista will not just still to just one favorite version of Scripture just to meet the qualification of their doctrine. That doesn't seem right. If you think that is, then I challenge you INC to ask God in revelation to help you provide your version of the Bible rather than just pick something just right on your side. Okay so here's the other translation and I added your Favorite Lamsa version Job Bautista.
Modern Translations
From the far east I will bring your offspring, and from the far west I will gather you.” (Isa. 43:5, Moffat Translation)
You use the Moffat version because of the Word Far East, but you can't confirm that in Hebrew Writings. Your cherry-picking won't work if you can't accept the fact that it has nothing to do with the Philippines as the Location of Isaiah's Prophecy. I have gaven you this information already from our previous discussions but you can't accept it. Let's try to look at it in Hebrew -
Do notאַל־ (’al-)
Adverb
Strong's 408: Not
be afraid,
תִּירָ֖א (tî·rā)
Verb - Qal - Imperfect - second person masculine singular
Strong's 3372: To fear, to revere, caus, to frighten
for
כִּ֣י (kî)
Conjunction
Strong's 3588: A relative conjunction
I
אָ֑נִי (’ā·nî)
Pronoun - first person common singular
Strong's 589: I
am with you;
אִתְּךָ־ (’it·tə·ḵā-)
Preposition | second person masculine singular
Strong's 854: Nearness, near, with, by, at, among
I will bring
אָבִ֣יא (’ā·ḇî)
Verb - Hifil - Imperfect - first person common singular
Strong's 935: To come in, come, go in, go
your offspring
זַרְעֶ֔ךָ (zar·‘e·ḵā)
Noun - masculine singular construct | second person masculine singular
Strong's 2233: Seed, fruit, plant, sowing-time, posterity
from the east,
מִמִּזְרָח֙ (mim·miz·rāḥ)
Preposition-m | Noun - masculine singular
Strong's 4217: Place of sunrise, the east
and gather you
אֲקַבְּצֶֽךָּ׃ (’ă·qab·bə·ṣe·kā)
Verb - Piel - Imperfect - first person common singular | second person masculine singular
Strong's 6908: To gather, collect
from the west.
וּמִֽמַּעֲרָ֖ב (ū·mim·ma·‘ă·rāḇ)
Conjunctive waw, Preposition-m | Noun - masculine singular
Strong's 4628: The west
So the Moffat Version has the Far East and this is not a problem of a normal reader who knows the context of the scripture. Isaiah Prophecy was all about the bondage of Israel to the other nation especially the Babylonian though during those times the Israelites are captives and some of them were wandering from the East to gain a living and land for their inheritances. To understand Isaiah's Prophecy we should go back to the very beginning of the chapter for us to know to whom it was addressed. And here's how it said -
I'm using New American Standard Version to these verses
1 But now, this is what the LORD says, He who is your Creator, Jacob, And He who formed you, Israel: “Do not fear, for I have redeemed you; I have called you by name; you are Mine!2 “When you pass through the waters, I will be with you; And through the rivers, they will not overflow you. When you walk through the fire, you will not be scorched, Nor will the flame burn you.
3 “For I am the LORD your God, The Holy One of Israel, your Savior; I have given Egypt as your ransom, [a]Cush and Seba in exchange for you.
4 “Since you are precious in My sight, Since you are honored and I love you, I will give other people in your place and other nations in exchange for your life.
5 “Do not fear, for I am with you; I will bring your offspring from the east, And gather you from the west.
This was all about the Promises of God to his Chosen people Israel and how they will be gathered even from a far country. It was never about the propagation or the missionary work but rather a physical gathering of the lost people or tribe of Israel.
OK so, I made so much explanation and it seems like it's your homework that I work out. You should know that Job Bautista, you're already matured enough to see how these things are irrelevant to your doctrine. This doesn't prove anything about the Philippines.
Let's try to look at some of the translations to confirm this scripture and that Job Bautista will not just still to just one favorite version of Scripture just to meet the qualification of their doctrine. That doesn't seem right. If you think that is, then I challenge you INC to ask God in revelation to help you provide your version of the Bible rather than just pick something just right on your side. Okay so here's the other translation and I added your Favorite Lamsa version Job Bautista.
Modern Translations
- New International Version - Do not be afraid, for I am with you; I will bring your children from the east and gather you from the west.
- New Living Translation - “Do not be afraid, for I am with you. I will gather you and your children from east and west.
- English Standard Version - Fear not, for I am with you; I will bring your offspring from the east, and from the west I will gather you.
- Berean Study Bible - Do not be afraid, for I am with you; I will bring your offspring from the east and gather you from the west.
- New American Standard Bible - “Do not fear, for I am with you; I will bring your offspring from the east, And gather you from the west.
- NASB 1995 - "Do not fear, for I am with you; I will bring your offspring from the east, And gather you from the west.
- NASB 1977 - “Do not fear, for I am with you; I will bring your offspring from the east, And gather you from the west.
- Amplified Bible - “Do not fear, for I am with you; I will bring your offspring from the east [where they are scattered], And gather you from the west.
- Christian Standard Bible - Do not fear, for I am with you; I will bring your descendants from the east, and gather you from the west.
- Holman Christian Standard Bible - Do not fear, for I am with you; I will bring your descendants from the east, and gather you from the west.
- Contemporary English Version - Don't be afraid! I am with you. From both east and west I will bring you together.
- Good News Translation - Do not be afraid--I am with you! "From the distant east and the farthest west I will bring your people home.
- GOD'S WORD® Translation - Do not be afraid, because I am with you. I will bring your descendants from the east and gather you from the west.
- International Standard Version - "Don't be afraid, for I am with you; I'll bring your children from the east, and gather you from the west.
- NET Bible - Don't be afraid, for I am with you. From the east I will bring your descendants; from the west I will gather you.
Classic Translations
- King James Bible - Fear not: for I am with thee: I will bring thy seed from the east, and gather thee from the west;
- New King James Version - Fear not, for I am with you; I will bring your descendants from the east, And gather you from the west;
- King James 2000 Bible - Fear not: for I am with you: I will bring your descendants from the east, and gather you from the west;
- New Heart English Bible - Do not be afraid; for I am with you. I will bring your descendants from the east, and gather you from the west.
- World English Bible - Don't be afraid; for I am with you. I will bring your seed from the east, and gather you from the west.
- American King James Version - Fear not: for I am with you: I will bring your seed from the east, and gather you from the west;
- American Standard Version - Fear not; for I am with thee: I will bring thy seed from the east, and gather thee from the west;
- A Faithful Version - Fear not; for I am with you. I will bring your seed from the east, and gather you from the west.
- Darby Bible Translation - Fear not, for I [am] with thee: I will bring thy seed from the east, and gather thee from the west;
- English Revised Version - Fear not; for I am with thee: I will bring thy seed from the east, and gather thee from the west;
- Webster's Bible Translation - Fear not: for I am with thee: I will bring thy seed from the east, and gather thee from the west;
Early Modern
- Geneva Bible of 1587 - Feare not, for I am with thee: I will bring thy seede from the East, and gather thee from the West.
- Bishops' Bible of 1568 - Feare not, for I am with thee, I will bryng thy seede from the east, and gather thee together from the west.
- Coverdale Bible of 1535 - that thou shuldest not feare, for I was with the. I wil bringe thy sede from the east, and gather the together from the west.
Literal Translations
- Literal Standard Version - Do not be afraid, for I [am] with you, "" I bring in your seed from the east, "" And I gather you from the west.
- Young's Literal Translation - Be not afraid, for I am with thee, From the east I bring in thy seed, And from the west I gather thee.
- Smith's Literal Translation - Thou shalt not fear, for I am with thee: I will bring thy seed from the sunrisings, and from the west I will gather thee.
Catholic Translations
- Douay-Rheims Bible - Fear not, for I am with thee: I will. bring thy seed from the east, and gather thee from the west.
Catholic Public Domain Version - Catholic Public Domain Version - Fear not, for I am with you. I will lead your offspring from the East, and I will gather you from the West.
- Peshitta Holy Bible Translated - You shall not fear, because I am with you. I shall bring your seed from the East, and from the West I shall gather you
Lamsa Bible - Lamsa Bible - Fear not; for I am with you; I will bring your descendants from the east, and gather you from the west;
- JPS Tanakh 1917 - Fear not, for I am with thee; I will bring thy seed from the east, And gather thee from the west;
Brenton Septuagint Translation - Brenton Septuagint Translation - Fear not; for I am with thee: I will bring thy seed from the east, and will gather thee from the west.
- Berean Study Bible - Do not be afraid, for I am with you; I will bring your offspring from the east and gather you from the west.
- Young's Literal Translation - Be not afraid, for I [am] with thee, From the east I bring in thy seed, And from the west I gather thee.
- Holman Christian Standard Bible - Do not fear, for I am with you; I will bring your descendants from the east, and gather you from the west.
- New American Standard Bible - "Do not fear, for I am with you; I will bring your offspring from the east, And gather you from the west.
- King James Bible - Fear not: for I [am] with thee: I will bring thy seed from the east, and gather thee from the west;
[Job Bautista]
Through deeper examination of the verse, we will notice that Prophet Isaiah explicitly says “east” (v.5) and “fron afar” (v.6). Now since the ones being prophesized as coming from the “east” (v.5) are the very ones referred as “from afar” (v.6).
The word afar off is not in the verse that you're quoting and not even in the rest of the versions that I collected for you. Looks like you're including it just because it is part of your doctrine. There are a couple of similar words "Afar off" or "From Afar" that don't say something about the Philippines or rather some distant land.
[Job Bautista]
Then it is clear that the ones being prophesized are “from afar” in the “east” or Far East.
Clear? No, I'm not a Bigot. But perhaps you can keep that since it is your doctrine. To accept it as the prophecy of the Philippines and the rise of the Iglesia Ni Christo is so absurd and I couldn't think of anything to link that prophecy about Felix and the INC church. Nothing at all.
[Job Bautista]
Iglesia Ni Cristo is firmly believing that James Moffat’s rendition is correct by substantiated by the fact that in original Hebrew, the word he translated as “far east” is mizrach (Isa. 43:5-6 Hebrew-English Tanakh by Jewish Publicationsl Society).
Yeah sure, it's your doctrine. Why would someone who seeks the truth that knows the bible would agree with that? This is simply absurd and you could not support your theology, if James Moffat's translation is correct then consider the rest of that version true, rather picking up only a part of it and proclaim it was the right verse to be true. That's not even comparing "Spiritual Things to Spiritual things" in Parallel Study. So, who would agree? NONE!
[Job Bautista]
Concerning the Hebrew term, “mizrach”, William Smith’s Dictionary of the Bible has this to say :
“EAST. THE HEBREW TERM KEDEM proper means which is before or in front of a person, and was applied to the east from the custom of turning in that direction when describing the points of the compass, before, behind, the right and left representing respectively east, west, north and south (Job 23:8, 9). The term generally used refers to the land lying immediately eastward of Palestine, Arabia, Mesopotamia and Babylonia. On the other hand, MIZRACH is USED OF THE FAR EAST with a less-definite signification (Isa. 43:5, Isa. 46:11).” [p. 154]
And do you think William Smith agrees that it is the Philippines that he meant or just simply a far country of the Promise land?
 |
| Some known Scholars disagree the INC Ideology |
[Job Bautista]
Here is the testimony of a reknown Bible scholar that “mizrach” is the Hebrew term used in Isaiah 43:5, and that this term is the equivalent in english of “far east”.
"Mizrach" (miz·rāḥ) Simply means East as to the direction of the Sunrise, you just added the Far East because of Moffat Translation, but there is no specific location if you are to take that translation literal as to where it faces. Here you're already debunking a couple of times in our discussions and still, you can't accept it just as accepting the scriptures word in your Lamsa Translation.
[Job Bautista]
That is the place where the Church of Christ or the Iglesia ni Cristo re-emerge from the Far East , the other sheep of Jesus John 10:16, Acts 2:39 , Acts 20:28 lamsa .
The other sheep is not a gentile nation and here you are still using it. Again, try to understand Christ words where he said to his disciples -
Matthew 10:5 These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not:
6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
How many times will I remind you for that and here you are trying to inject your doctrine of man. See my Post for Neil Andi Anderson at https://truth-reflects.blogspot.com/2021/09/part-1-neil-andi-anderson-responding.html?m=1 and answer the question for him since he can't keep up answering it.
 |
| And here you are Pointing South East. So, how was it fulfilled? |
Part 6 - Job Bautista: Far East Study
Here's another Job Bautista fail Study. It's kinda funny though and how he made some assumptions about the propagation of The LDS in Book of Mormon times. Without further ado let's dive in - see text in red for my comments.
His introduction -
[Job Bautista]
Jerry Nuñez Bustillo
Lds cult church propagation start from the Southwart to Northward ; read -
And he thinks it is the start of LDS church using the Book of Mormon as evidence of some puzzles that he can't solve.
[Job Bautista]Helaman 3: 8 And it came to pass that they did multiply and spread, and did go forth from the land southward to the land northward, and did spread insomuch that they began to cover the face of the whole earth, from the sea south to the sea north, from the sea west to the sea east.
This story is not even related to any ministry or proselyting or whatever missionary related. This was all about the spread of their community southward of the land and they start their living. To understand the Context Job Bautista since you are always out of context and does not even care what you quoted, here's the part of it to see that it was not about sending missionary abroad, but rather their travel to the entire land to build their houses and whatsoever they can live.
[Helaman 3]
4 And they did travel to an exceedingly great distance, insomuch that they came to large bodies of water and many rivers.
5 Yea, and even they did spread forth into all parts of the land, into whatever parts it had not been rendered desolate and without timber, because of the many inhabitants who had before inherited the land.
6 And now no part of the land was desolate, save it were for timber; but because of the greatness of the destruction of the people who had before inhabited the land it was called desolate.
7 And there being but little timber upon the face of the land, nevertheless the people who went forth became exceedingly expert in the working of cement; therefore they did build houses of cement, in the which they did dwell.
8 And it came to pass that they did multiply and spread, and did go forth from the land southward to the land northward, and did spread insomuch that they began to cover the face of the whole earth, from the sea south to the sea north, from the sea west to the sea east.
9 And the people who were in the land northward did dwell in tents, and in houses of cement, and they did suffer whatsoever tree should spring up upon the face of the land that it should grow up, that in time they might have timber to build their houses, yea, their cities, and their temples, and their synagogues, and their sanctuaries, and all manner of their buildings.
(see text in bold)
So, what was it all about Job Bautista? Will I guest the Book of Mormon already explain that to you? Do you understand what you are point out or the doctrine of Manalo? I guess you need some Reading Comprehension. It's a Problems, you know.
[Job Bautista]
If you can see the propagation of the Lds church start from southward to Northward and they cover the face of the whole Earth ? And from the sea North , from the sea west to the East according to the BOM.
As I have said, it was not about the propagation or spreading of the Gospel. You just need some work out of your brain cells. Read the context and find something about sending missionaries or preaching the Gospel. You can't find it there because it wasn't all about it.
[Job Bautista]
We are sure that the the Lds church is not the true Church , because the direction of their propagation and place is different from direction of the prophecy of God written in the Bible . They are not the chosen people of God , they are the goats at the left hand of Jesus as describe.
And I'm pretty sure you are even worse than goats. And it was not yet spread during the time of Isaiah. Christ even proclaimed to avoid the way of the Gentile. You are just too slow to understand the scripture because of the bigoted teaching that you always insisted on.
Matthew 10:5 These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not:
Did Christ say something about preaching to the Gentiles? He clearly explains to avoid Gentiles' way for the gospel is not yet prepared for them. The propagation of the Gospel during Christ's time was yet limited to the Tribe of Israel. So how come the Philippines was the other sheep and how did they fulfill the prophecy while the gospel wasn't yet preached to them?
[Job Bautista]What is the prophecy of God concerning the re-emerging of the Church of Christ , His chosen people from the Far East to reach up to the Far West ? Read ;
You're brainwashed by your Paid Ministers. There is no prophesy that the gospel will start in the far east or from the west and wherever rather it will spread everywhere from the Jews first then to the Gentiles. And how would you define Christ said that it wasn't yet spread to the Gentile nation not until his ascension and there you are claiming it already in the Philippines. If you could trace the Line of Authority of Felix Manalo then we can simply start there rather than making a claim of some geographical pieces of evidence that has nothing to do with the Restoration of the Gospel.
[Job Bautista]From the far east I will bring your offspring, and from the far west I will gather you.” (Isa. 43:5, Moffat Translation)
You use the Moffat version because of the Word Far East, but you can't confirm that in Hebrew Writings. Your cherry-picking won't work if you can't accept the fact that it has nothing to do with the Philippines as the Location of Isaiah's Prophecy. I have gaven you this information already from our previous discussions but you can't accept it. Let's try to look at it in Hebrew -
Do not, אַל־ (’al-), Adverb, Strong's 408: Not
be afraid, תִּירָ֖א (tî·rā), Verb - Qal - Imperfect - second person masculine singular, Strong's 3372: To fear, to revere, caus, to frighten
for, כִּ֣י (kî) Conjunction, Strong's 3588: A relative conjunction
I, אָ֑נִי (’ā·nî) Pronoun - first person common singular, Strong's 589: I
am with you; אִתְּךָ־ (’it·tə·ḵā-), Preposition | second person masculine singular, Strong's 854: Nearness, near, with, by, at, among
I will bring, אָבִ֣יא (’ā·ḇî), Verb - Hifil - Imperfect - first person common singular, Strong's 935: To come in, come, go in, goyour offspring, זַרְעֶ֔ךָ (zar·‘e·ḵā), Noun - masculine singular construct | second person masculine singular, Strong's 2233: Seed, fruit, plant, sowing-time, posterity
from the east, מִמִּזְרָח֙ (mim·miz·rāḥ), Preposition-m | Noun - masculine singular, Strong's 4217: Place of sunrise, the east
and gather you, אֲקַבְּצֶֽךָּ׃ (’ă·qab·bə·ṣe·kā), Verb - Piel - Imperfect - first person common singular | second person masculine singular, Strong's 6908: To gather, collect
from the west., וּמִֽמַּעֲרָ֖ב (ū·mim·ma·‘ă·rāḇ), Conjunctive waw, Preposition-m | Noun - masculine singular, Strong's 4628: The west
So the Moffat Version has the Far East and this is not a problem of a normal reader who knows the context of the scripture. Isaiah Prophecy was all about the bondage of Israel to the other nation especially the Babylonian though during those times the Israelites are captives and some of them were wandering from the East to gain a living and land for their inheritances. To understand Isaiah's Prophecy we should go back to the very beginning of the chapter for us to know to whom it was addressed. And here's how it said -
I'm using New American Standard Version to these verses
1 But now, this is what the LORD says, He who is your Creator, Jacob, And He who formed you, Israel: “Do not fear, for I have redeemed you; I have called you by name; you are Mine!
2 “When you pass through the waters, I will be with you; And through the rivers, they will not overflow you. When you walk through the fire, you will not be scorched, Nor will the flame burn you.
3 “For I am the LORD your God, The Holy One of Israel, your Savior; I have given Egypt as your ransom, [a]Cush and Seba in exchange for you.
4 “Since you are precious in My sight, Since you are honored and I love you, I will give other people in your place and other nations in exchange for your life.
5 “Do not fear, for I am with you; I will bring your offspring from the east, And gather you from the west.
This was all about the Promises of God to his Chosen people Israel and how they will be gathered even from a far country. It was never about the propagation or the missionary work but rather a physical gathering of the lost people or tribe of Israel.
OK so, I made so much explanation and it seems like it's your homework that I work out. You should know that Job Bautista, you're already matured enough to see how these things are irrelevant to your doctrine. This doesn't prove anything about the Philippines.
Let's try to look at some of the translations to confirm this scripture and that Job Bautista will not just still to just one favorite version of Scripture just to meet the qualification of their doctrine. That doesn't seem right. If you think that is, then I challenge you INC to ask God in revelation to help you provide your version of the Bible rather than just pick something just right on your side. Okay so here's the other translation and I added your Favorite Lamsa version Job Bautista.
Modern Translations
- New International Version - Do not be afraid, for I am with you; I will bring your children from the east and gather you from the west.
- New Living Translation - “Do not be afraid, for I am with you. I will gather you and your children from east and west.
- English Standard Version - Fear not, for I am with you; I will bring your offspring from the east, and from the west I will gather you.
- Berean Study Bible - Do not be afraid, for I am with you; I will bring your offspring from the east and gather you from the west.
- New American Standard Bible - “Do not fear, for I am with you; I will bring your offspring from the east, And gather you from the west.
- NASB 1995 - "Do not fear, for I am with you; I will bring your offspring from the east, And gather you from the west.
- NASB 1977 - “Do not fear, for I am with you; I will bring your offspring from the east, And gather you from the west.
- Amplified Bible - “Do not fear, for I am with you; I will bring your offspring from the east [where they are scattered], And gather you from the west.
- Christian Standard Bible - Do not fear, for I am with you; I will bring your descendants from the east, and gather you from the west.
- Holman Christian Standard Bible - Do not fear, for I am with you; I will bring your descendants from the east, and gather you from the west.
- Contemporary English Version - Don't be afraid! I am with you. From both east and west I will bring you together.
- Good News Translation - Do not be afraid--I am with you! "From the distant east and the farthest west I will bring your people home.
- GOD'S WORD® Translation - Do not be afraid, because I am with you. I will bring your descendants from the east and gather you from the west.
- International Standard Version - "Don't be afraid, for I am with you; I'll bring your children from the east, and gather you from the west.
- NET Bible - Don't be afraid, for I am with you. From the east I will bring your descendants; from the west I will gather you.
Classic Translations
- King James Bible - Fear not: for I am with thee: I will bring thy seed from the east, and gather thee from the west;
- New King James Version - Fear not, for I am with you; I will bring your descendants from the east, And gather you from the west;
- King James 2000 Bible - Fear not: for I am with you: I will bring your descendants from the east, and gather you from the west;
- New Heart English Bible - Do not be afraid; for I am with you. I will bring your descendants from the east, and gather you from the west.
- World English Bible - Don't be afraid; for I am with you. I will bring your seed from the east, and gather you from the west.
- American King James Version - Fear not: for I am with you: I will bring your seed from the east, and gather you from the west;
- American Standard Version - Fear not; for I am with thee: I will bring thy seed from the east, and gather thee from the west;
- A Faithful Version - Fear not; for I am with you. I will bring your seed from the east, and gather you from the west.
- Darby Bible Translation - Fear not, for I [am] with thee: I will bring thy seed from the east, and gather thee from the west;
- English Revised Version - Fear not; for I am with thee: I will bring thy seed from the east, and gather thee from the west;
- Webster's Bible Translation - Fear not: for I am with thee: I will bring thy seed from the east, and gather thee from the west;
Early Modern
- Geneva Bible of 1587 - Feare not, for I am with thee: I will bring thy seede from the East, and gather thee from the West.
- Bishops' Bible of 1568 - Feare not, for I am with thee, I will bryng thy seede from the east, and gather thee together from the west.
- Coverdale Bible of 1535 - that thou shuldest not feare, for I was with the. I wil bringe thy sede from the east, and gather the together from the west.
Literal Translations
- Literal Standard Version - Do not be afraid, for I [am] with you, "" I bring in your seed from the east, "" And I gather you from the west.
- Young's Literal Translation - Be not afraid, for I am with thee, From the east I bring in thy seed, And from the west I gather thee.
- Smith's Literal Translation - Thou shalt not fear, for I am with thee: I will bring thy seed from the sunrisings, and from the west I will gather thee.
Catholic Translations
- Douay-Rheims Bible - Fear not, for I am with thee: I will. bring thy seed from the east, and gather thee from the west.
Catholic Public Domain Version - Catholic Public Domain Version - Fear not, for I am with you. I will lead your offspring from the East, and I will gather you from the West.
- Peshitta Holy Bible Translated - You shall not fear, because I am with you. I shall bring your seed from the East, and from the West I shall gather you
Lamsa Bible - Lamsa Bible - Fear not; for I am with you; I will bring your descendants from the east, and gather you from the west;
- JPS Tanakh 1917 - Fear not, for I am with thee; I will bring thy seed from the east, And gather thee from the west;
Brenton Septuagint Translation - Brenton Septuagint Translation - Fear not; for I am with thee: I will bring thy seed from the east, and will gather thee from the west.
- Berean Study Bible - Do not be afraid, for I am with you; I will bring your offspring from the east and gather you from the west.
- Young's Literal Translation - Be not afraid, for I [am] with thee, From the east I bring in thy seed, And from the west I gather thee.
- Holman Christian Standard Bible - Do not fear, for I am with you; I will bring your descendants from the east, and gather you from the west.
- New American Standard Bible - "Do not fear, for I am with you; I will bring your offspring from the east, And gather you from the west.
- King James Bible - Fear not: for I [am] with thee: I will bring thy seed from the east, and gather thee from the west;
[Job Bautista]
Through deeper examination of the verse, we will notice that Prophet Isaiah explicitly says “east” (v.5) and “fron afar” (v.6). Now since the ones being prophesized as coming from the “east” (v.5) are the very ones referred as “from afar” (v.6).
The word afar off is not in the verse that you're quoting and not even in the rest of the versions that I collected for you. Looks like you're including it just because it is part of your doctrine. There are a couple of similar words "Afar off" or "From Afar" that don't say something about the Philippines or rather some distant land.
[Job Bautista]
Then it is clear that the ones being prophesized are “from afar” in the “east” or Far East.
Clear? No, I'm not a Bigot. But perhaps you can keep that since it is your doctrine. To accept it as the prophecy of the Philippines and the rise of the Iglesia Ni Christo is so absurd and I couldn't think of anything to link that prophecy about Felix and the INC church. Nothing at all.
[Job Bautista]
Iglesia Ni Cristo is firmly believing that James Moffat’s rendition is correct by substantiated by the fact that in original Hebrew, the word he translated as “far east” is mizrach (Isa. 43:5-6 Hebrew-English Tanakh by Jewish Publicationsl Society).
Yeah sure, it's your doctrine. Why would someone who seeks the truth that knows the bible would agree with that? This is simply absurd and you could not support your theology, if James Moffat's translation is correct then consider the rest of that version true, rather picking up only a part of it and proclaim it was the right verse to be true. That's not even comparing "Spiritual Things to Spiritual things" in Parallel Study. So, who would agree? NONE!
[Job Bautista]
Concerning the Hebrew term, “mizrach”, William Smith’s Dictionary of the Bible has this to say :
“EAST. THE HEBREW TERM KEDEM proper means which is before or in front of a person, and was applied to the east from the custom of turning in that direction when describing the points of the compass, before, behind, the right and left representing respectively east, west, north and south (Job 23:8, 9). The term generally used refers to the land lying immediately eastward of Palestine, Arabia, Mesopotamia and Babylonia. On the other hand, MIZRACH is USED OF THE FAR EAST with a less-definite signification (Isa. 43:5, Isa. 46:11).” [p. 154]
And do you think William Smith agrees that it is the Philippines that he meant or just simply a far country of the Promise land?
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| Some known Scholars disagree the INC Ideology |
[Job Bautista]
Here is the testimony of a reknown Bible scholar that “mizrach” is the Hebrew term used in Isaiah 43:5, and that this term is the equivalent in english of “far east”.
"Mizrach" (miz·rāḥ) Simply means East as to the direction of the Sunrise, you just added the Far East because of Moffat Translation, but there is no specific location if you are to take that translation literal as to where it faces. Here you're already debunking a couple of times in our discussions and still, you can't accept it just as accepting the scriptures word in your Lamsa Translation.
[Job Bautista]
That is the place where the Church of Christ or the Iglesia ni Cristo re-emerge from the Far East , the other sheep of Jesus John 10:16, Acts 2:39 , Acts 20:28 lamsa .
The other sheep is not a gentile nation and here you are still using it. Again, try to understand Christ words where he said to his disciples -
Matthew 10:5 These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not:
6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
How many times will I remind you for that and here you are trying to inject your doctrine of man. See my Post for Neil Andi Anderson at https://truth-reflects.blogspot.com/2021/09/part-1-neil-andi-anderson-responding.html?m=1 and answer the question for him since he can't keep up answering it.
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| And here you are Pointing South East. So, how was it fulfilled? |
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