Here once again is an attack from our INC antagonist, one of the INC Bigot named Job Bautista. He wants to know something about the sacrament that was instituted by the church and why water was used instead of wine. Without any time wasted, let's dive in. Texts in color are my comments.
It wasn't the issue. But yes there is a scripture about that question of yours. |
But one of the soldiers with a spear pierced his side, and forthwith came there out blood and water. John 19:34
May tanong tayo kay Jerry Nuñez Bustillo isa magiting na tagapagtanggol ni Joseph Smith, ayon sa kanya sa kanilang pagbabanal na Hapunan o Santa Cena ay iniinom din naman sila at kumakain.
He is saying about the weekly Sacrament, the bread and water that was used and symbolised as Christ atonement. We never use such words as Santa Cena or they call it Holy Supper Suffer since we are not doing it yearly as INCs yearly rituals and most of all it is not Hapunan or Supper Suffer. We instituted it every week and not evening. Sa inyong paginom ba ng tubig meron bang nalalasing sa inyo sa tubig ? He is asking this stupid question that has nothing to do with sacrament. We drink the water yes, but not to be drunk as you think it is biblically. You can't support that if we open up. Anyway, let's move on.
Ayon pa sa tagapagtanggol ng kulto na ang simbolo ng ng dugo ni Panginoong Jesus ay ang kupeta at hindi ang laman ng kupeta na siyang ubas .
I never said it was the symbol of his blood but rather a liquid inside the cup generally speaking, and I don't think Christ use that word cup when it wasn't used for its purpose. Too slow.
Basahin natin ang pahayag ni Apostol Pablo.
Below are the scriptures that he use so I'm gonna use them and see if he could comprehend how it was used. I'll mark some words and let's try to look at it and see how it was said -
1 Mga Taga-Corinto 11:20 Kaya't sa inyong pagtitipon, hindi Banal na Hapunan ng Panginoon ang kinakain ninyo.
Banal Na Hapunan as the version of Scripture he use, but the greek word was used is Lord's Supper Suffer not Holy Supper Suffer. See below
Συνερχομένων οὖν ὑμῶν ἐπὶ τὸ αὐτὸ οὐκ ἔστιν κυριακὸν δεῖπνον φαγεῖν·
The Greek word (κυριακὸν δεῖπνον, kyriakon deipnon) which was simply mean the Lord's Supper. The usage of the Holy Supper was not mentioned in the former greek rather a revision of text as translated to different versions. And which indeed they (the INC use it inaccurately). But we'll just skip that as is of this time since it wasn't the issue in this post. A list of different versions below will be posted after this post.
1 Mga Taga-Corinto 11:21 Sapagkat ang bawat isa sa inyo'y nagmamadali sa pagkain ng kanyang baong pagkain, kaya't nagugutom ang iba at ang iba nama'y nalalasing.
1 Mga Taga-Corinto 11:22 Wala ba kayong sariling bahay upang doon kumain at uminom? O hinahamak ninyo ang iglesya ng Diyos at hinihiya ang mahihirap? Ano ang gagawin ko ngayon? Ipagmamalaki ko ba kayo dahil sa bagay na iyon? Hinding-hindi ko gagawin iyon!
1 Mga Taga-Corinto 11:23 Ito ang katuruang tinanggap ko sa Panginoon at ibinigay ko naman sa inyo: noong gabing siya'y ipagkanulo, ang Panginoong Jesus ay dumampot ng tinapay,
1 Mga Taga-Corinto 11:24 nagpasalamat at pinagpira-piraso iyon, at sinabi, “Ito ang aking katawan na inihahandog para sa inyo. Gawin ninyo ito bilang pag-aalaala sa akin.”
1 Mga Taga-Corinto 11:25 Matapos maghapunan, dumampot din siya ng kopa at sinabi, “Ang kopang ito ay ang bagong tipan ng Diyos na pinagtibay ng aking dugo. Tuwing iinumin ninyo ito, gawin ninyo bilang pag-aalaala sa akin.”
1 Mga Taga-Corinto 11:26 Sapagkat tuwing kakain kayo ng tinapay na ito at iinom sa kopang ito, ipinapahayag ninyo ang kamatayan ng Panginoon hanggang sa kanyang muling pagparito.
1 Mga Taga-Corinto 11:27 Ang sinumang kumakain ng tinapay at umiinom sa kopa ng Panginoon sa paraang di nararapat ay nagkakasala sa katawan at dugo ng Panginoon.
1 Mga Taga-Corinto 11:28 Kaya't dapat siyasatin ng tao ang kanyang sarili bago siya kumain ng tinapay at uminom sa kopa.
1 Mga Taga-Corinto 11:29 Sapagkat ang sinumang kumakain at umiinom nang hindi kinikilala ang kahalagahan ng katawan ng Panginoon ay kumakain at umiinom ng kahatulan laban sa kanyang sarili.
What kind of Argument was that? You're trying to bend it and yet you fail because of your stupidity. |
For as often as ye eat this bread, and drink this cup, ye do shew the Lord’s death till he come. 1 Corinthians 11:26
So, what's written? Paul's letter to the Corinthians gives us an understanding that the Cup to drink the blood of Christ (Symbolical). The cup used generally something to put on a liquid. Paul did not give a specific kind of liquid element. But let's get to it straight to be fair. During those times they use wine as one of their traditions. There are later instructions that were received these days in applying the same ordinance.
Tubig ba ang kanilang ininom na nakakalasing ?
You still kept that question and yet you have no ground to stand on that claim. First of all, there is nowhere you can find that after they drink the cup they got drunk because of wine. You cannot support that. Second, it wasn't even in your quote that they used the fruit of the vine as the thing goes on Christ days, it was Cup, not fruit not wine.
Lucas 22:18 Sinasabi ko sa inyo, mula ngayo'y hindi na ako iinom nitong KATAS NG UBAS hangga't hindi dumarating ang kaharian ng Diyos.”
Lucas 22:19 Dumampot din siya ng tinapay, at matapos magpasalamat sa Diyos ay kanyang pinaghati-hati iyon at ibinigay sa kanila. Sabi niya, “Ito ang aking katawan na inihahandog para sa inyo. Gawin ninyo ito bilang pag-alaala sa akin.”
Lucas 22:20 Gayundin naman, dinampot niya ang kopa pagkatapos maghapunan at sinabi, “Ang kopang ito ang bagong tipan ng Diyos na pinagtibay ng aking dugo. Ang aking dugo ay mabubuhos alang-alang sa inyo.
Okay so... What did Christ say? He wouldn't drink of the fruit of the vine. And how do you observe that? And on verse 20 he used the term Cup, not wine. Does this have something to do with your ignorance?
You're trying to look at the word game that you missed a few previous words. Nice one on your cherry-picking idea, and yet you fail.
So here's the thing. Christ instituted the sacrament to them in remembrance of him and his sacrifice for us. The cup he will drink is not a cup that was selected by your ministers but rather a better cup that the father gave to him -
... the cup which my Father hath given me, shall I not drink it? - John 18:11
The cup is simply the sacrifice he will perform. It is not sweet and in fact, the Book of Mormon clarified Christ words -
And behold, I am the light and the life of the world; and I have drunk out of that bitter cup which the Father hath given me, and have glorified the Father in taking upon me the sins of the world, in the which I have suffered the will of the Father in all things from the beginning. - 3 Nephi 11:11
Again, if this all symbolizes his death. Then there's no reason for Christ and the apostles to celebrate and get drunk during Christ's last supper suffer. That is a total absurd Job Bautista. Also, do you purchase wine in the beverage section in the supermarket? Or, directly from the fruit of the vine? I guess you don't get fruit directly from the vine.
Fruit of the Vine or the Bottle? |
Sa halip na KATAS NG UBAS ang kanilang ininom ng kulto ni Joseph Smith naghaka-haka sila na tubig nalang ang ginamit nila at ito raw ay symbolical ng dugo ni Panginoong Jesucristo sa pagtubos ng Iglesia ni Cristo. Gawa 20:28 Lamsa
Seriously, was that the very purpose of his death? And when did I say it was about the hour? |
"God purchase his own Blood" 😁. You Can not support that, you keep using that special version of yours. Anyway, as we move on. To support that idea Job. The Prophet received revelation on why the Grapes were replaced by water. But actually, it was never a big deal since before this revelation, the saints use wine in administering the sacrament. In fact, it was even in the Book of Mormon and in Doctrine and Covenants about the sacramental prayer in which wine was used. Here's the text to let you know -
O God, the Eternal Father, we ask thee, in the name of thy Son, Jesus Christ, to bless and sanctify this wine to the souls of all those who drink of it, that they may do it in remembrance of the blood of thy Son, which was shed for them; that they may witness unto thee, O God, the Eternal Father, that they do always remember him, that they may have his Spirit to be with them. Amen. - Moroni 5:2, D&C 20:
There are reasons why some instructions are given after, and for that, let's try to put some of it here -
2 For, behold, I say unto you, that it mattereth not what ye shall eat or what ye shall drink when ye partake of the sacrament, if it so be that ye do it with an eye single to my glory—remembering unto the Father my body which was laid down for you, and my blood which was shed for the remission of your sins.
3 Wherefore, a commandment I give unto you, that you shall not purchase wine neither strong drink of your enemies;
4 Wherefore, you shall partake of none except it is made new among you; yea, in this my Father’s kingdom which shall be built up on the earth.
5 Behold, this is wisdom in me; wherefore, marvel not, for the hour cometh that I will drink of the fruit of the vine with you on the earth, and with Moroni, whom I have sent unto you to reveal the Book of Mormon, containing the fulness of my everlasting gospel, to whom I have committed the keys of the record of the stick of Ephraim;
- Doctrine and Covenants 27:2-5
It was instructed to use wine out of their own make, meaning from the plants grown in their own farm or vineyard.
And, behold, this should be wine, yea, pure wine of the grape of the vine, of your own make - D&C 89:6
Question to you Job Bautista. Do you make your own grape juice as the fruit of the vine or just simply purchase it in a supermarket? What did the scripture say? You can justify it whatever you want, but you can't support it biblically.
Kaya sila hindi naman talaga Iglesia ni Cristo, kaya sila naghaka haka na lamang sa kanilang Banal na hapunan. Narito ang kanilang ginawa.
And there goes that Banal na Hapunan (Holy Supper Suffer) thing. Ok, so when do you people celebrate that? Did you receive revelation to perform it on the exact date when Christ held it? Does any INC has that record on when did Christ perform it or does the scripture says often?
For as often as ye eat this bread, and drink this cup, ye do shew the Lord’s death till he come. - 1 Corinthians 11:26
Ok, so when do you perform that Holy Supper Suffer of INC? March? Where's your revelation about it? Or was it another copycat movement of INC? So where did you steal that ideology?
Oh really? Thanks for your Opinion. |
On one occasion, Ellen G. White made some comments about the Lord's Supper and the Passover that was debated in its observance. Here are part of it -
"As we had before us the emblems of our dying Lord, and were about to commemorate His sufferings, this brother arose and said that he had no faith in what we were about to do; that the Lord's supper was a continuation of the Passover, and should be partaken of but once a year.
...
The leaders of the Seventh-day Adventist Church, including Ellen G. White, since that time have consistently maintained that the observance of the Lord's Supper is not a continuation of the Passover of ancient times, and that partaking of the communion service is not to be restricted to Passover time and thus held but once a year.
(Click here to learn more... )
If Passover was to be observed in between March and early April, does this mean this INC didn't know about the importance of Lord's Supper Suffer rather a part of the Jewish Feast or Tradition? This leads us that this kind of church was not guided by revelations at all.
He made a personal attack to Crisandra Sambrano who just want to speak up about her views. |
And by this time, Job Bautista attacks one of the members made it too personal. Paste it in his wall and made such an attempt to shame someone. Is this what the INC claimed the church of God by stumping on someone's faith? Let's examine his attacked and Ad Feminam.
Pagbubunyag sa maling aral sa kulto ni Joseph Smith .
Crisandra Sambrano VillanuevaPahayag niya ss :
At tama na nagpakita sa akin ang Panginoon sa vision ko, at tubig ang ginamit nyang symbol para sa message na sinabi nya sa akin, yan ay personal na message nya sa akin dahil ang vision ko ay para lang sa akin.
Ito ang pahayag ni Crisandra Sambrano Villanueva, isang magiting na tagapagtanggol sa aral ni Joseph Smith . Isa yata itong propetae ?
A picture grab by Job Bautista for criticism. |
Note to the Readers: Since Job Baustista is too arrogant in keeping a healthy discussion, but rather pointing out some of his stupid word gameplay.
Is this all you got? Do you still have anything to stand on? Or just want it to shift into a personal thing? So, I guess we're all clear that you can't keep it up. |
He thinks the typos are intentional so I'm making some word corrections and admitting my typo error, since I did not make some proofread while doing this blog, so I give my credit to Job Baustista for his Arrogant wordplay.
Oh, really? So, what the big deal if I misspelled it. What's your point? |
Thanks, Job Bautista, below are some of our conversations and his senseless response. -
Say what? By just simply understanding the text you tend to ignore the fact that you INCult misunderstood the Concept of Lord's Supper? |
Look at that? So, How many INC Minions are still childish nowadays? Yeah, this guy is always in a wordplay |
And it seems like your running out of Criticism. Seems like you can't keep up the issue. Good try on your running. |
- To be continue